Nova Spivack - My Public Twine
- Share
From "World Wide Web" to "Web Wide World" -- The Web Breaks Out of its Petri Dish
Note added by Nova Spivack on 09/18/2008Public
Comments
- threads
- flat
11
by
wildcat
2 months ago
Nova:" Things are not going to turn out the way we thought. Instead of everything going digital -- a future in which we all live as avatars in cyberspace -- The digital world is going to invade the physical world. We already are the avatars and the physical world is becoming cyberspace. The idea that cyberspace is some other place is going to dissolve because everything will be part of the Web."
Brightly put, however, I think that the term we should use is not "instead" but 'simultaneous convergence' in both directions. there is no doubt that the world is heading into a physical space that is augmented and hyperconnected, and yes eventually every physical object will become a smart interrelated and semantically correlated artifact of our civilization, and yes i agree that the noosphere is finally emerging. having said that, I believe that some will desire to continue the progress of online life, possibly culminating in some form or other of mind upload, when the technology will be available.
the new global body which you describe, is good news, for by hyperconnectivity we exemplify our empathic nature, and yet (and maybe because of that) we need allow the space for all forms of human cognition to take place, hence whilst it is true that the digital invades the physical, it is also true that physical invades the digital.
we are building a global mind, and now is the time to tackle the really hard questions: Identity, consciousness, evolution, empathy (and many many others).
We may also desire to remember that the Internet evolution magazine reports:" TechCrunch50 conference, startup Imindi, which offers a service involving the mapping of thoughts and associations in a database for use in social networking, received a hostile welcome from Silicon Valley. This does not mean that the Imindi service lacks innovation. On the contrary, Imindi might just be too novel for many people .
The Imindi (http://imindi.com/) founders have challenged the world to think of artificial intelligence not as making computers smarter because of human beings, but as making humans smarter because of computers. "
we may need come up with a more integrated vision, to allow the full blown emergence of a conscious world to come forth and shine.
thanks for an inspiring note
W.
ps. thank you Olivier, the paper you linked to deals with some very serious questions
Brightly put, however, I think that the term we should use is not "instead" but 'simultaneous convergence' in both directions. there is no doubt that the world is heading into a physical space that is augmented and hyperconnected, and yes eventually every physical object will become a smart interrelated and semantically correlated artifact of our civilization, and yes i agree that the noosphere is finally emerging. having said that, I believe that some will desire to continue the progress of online life, possibly culminating in some form or other of mind upload, when the technology will be available.
the new global body which you describe, is good news, for by hyperconnectivity we exemplify our empathic nature, and yet (and maybe because of that) we need allow the space for all forms of human cognition to take place, hence whilst it is true that the digital invades the physical, it is also true that physical invades the digital.
we are building a global mind, and now is the time to tackle the really hard questions: Identity, consciousness, evolution, empathy (and many many others).
We may also desire to remember that the Internet evolution magazine reports:" TechCrunch50 conference, startup Imindi, which offers a service involving the mapping of thoughts and associations in a database for use in social networking, received a hostile welcome from Silicon Valley. This does not mean that the Imindi service lacks innovation. On the contrary, Imindi might just be too novel for many people .
The Imindi (http://imindi.com/) founders have challenged the world to think of artificial intelligence not as making computers smarter because of human beings, but as making humans smarter because of computers. "
we may need come up with a more integrated vision, to allow the full blown emergence of a conscious world to come forth and shine.
thanks for an inspiring note
W.
ps. thank you Olivier, the paper you linked to deals with some very serious questions
95
by
Yihong Ding
2 months ago
thank you for reading and mentioning my post, wild.
I very much agree to your comment. Identity, consciousness, and evolution have become critical issues. The next breakthrough (i.e. lifting the Web up to another stage beyond Web 2.0) must be some significant innovation on these fields (or at least one of these fields).
Yihong
I very much agree to your comment. Identity, consciousness, and evolution have become critical issues. The next breakthrough (i.e. lifting the Web up to another stage beyond Web 2.0) must be some significant innovation on these fields (or at least one of these fields).
Yihong
55
by
Mark Szpakowski
2 months ago
Indeed - the noosphere does not replace the other *spheres (biosphere, atmosphere, geosphere), or live in isolation from them, but layers over them, and penetrates and permeates them in distributed attention. Webcelium....
95
by
Yihong Ding
2 months ago
Nova,
thank you for the note. I like it and it is well written. The Web is extending itself gradually out of a network of computers, but to a more and more sophisticated network.
It is quite a coincidence. After my article of "a new take of internet-base AI", I am writing another article for Internet Evolution discussing the similar issue you have shared in this note. I would like to see how you may think of it after it is released.
Anyway, thank you again. As usual, you often bring us the most advanced thinking about the progress of World Wide Web.
Yihong
thank you for the note. I like it and it is well written. The Web is extending itself gradually out of a network of computers, but to a more and more sophisticated network.
It is quite a coincidence. After my article of "a new take of internet-base AI", I am writing another article for Internet Evolution discussing the similar issue you have shared in this note. I would like to see how you may think of it after it is released.
Anyway, thank you again. As usual, you often bring us the most advanced thinking about the progress of World Wide Web.
Yihong
by
Alvis Brigis
8 weeks ago
Some systems context for Nova's observations: http://memebox.com/futureblogger/show/915-nova-spivack-s-web-as-world-observation-leads-us-further-down-the-rabbit-hole
BTW, I am a Twine noob and have no idea how to track-back to threads in here. Do I just add twine wads? Help! :)
BTW, I am a Twine noob and have no idea how to track-back to threads in here. Do I just add twine wads? Help! :)
by
Paul Roberts
8 weeks ago
This is my first comment since joining Twine last week. Can I say I'm happy to be here!
Nova, your Web Wide World is similar conceptually to 'pervasive data', 'ubiquitous communications' and 'ambient intelligence' - in short, this trend has been coming for some time. Your value-add is to thread recent developments and provide some clarity over what the concepts mean in practice - excellent for those that need actual experience of something new before they can understand it.
I agree with the trend that you outlined but I can't help but feel there is a flip-side, and it goes to the digital divide. I feel attracted to the Web Wide World - bring it on! But to participate and gain socially and economically in the digital world presupposes having the literacies to do and valuing openness and transparency. Differences is skills and capacities will create new social and economic divides. Some will be more digital than others.
Institutions value secrecy, businesses compete aggressively and there is always a war on somewhere.
The web is a social phenomenon more than anything else, but what about those who would rather be alone - or at least offline some of the time - and those that demand secrecy?
Nova, your Web Wide World is similar conceptually to 'pervasive data', 'ubiquitous communications' and 'ambient intelligence' - in short, this trend has been coming for some time. Your value-add is to thread recent developments and provide some clarity over what the concepts mean in practice - excellent for those that need actual experience of something new before they can understand it.
I agree with the trend that you outlined but I can't help but feel there is a flip-side, and it goes to the digital divide. I feel attracted to the Web Wide World - bring it on! But to participate and gain socially and economically in the digital world presupposes having the literacies to do and valuing openness and transparency. Differences is skills and capacities will create new social and economic divides. Some will be more digital than others.
Institutions value secrecy, businesses compete aggressively and there is always a war on somewhere.
The web is a social phenomenon more than anything else, but what about those who would rather be alone - or at least offline some of the time - and those that demand secrecy?
by
Alvis Brigis
8 weeks ago
Good points Paul.
I agree that along with the new era there will develop a new divide. At the same time,increasingly smart software and knowledge networks will push to make participation super easy and automatic. It will force us to reciprocally develop the skills to maintain privacy. You will really need to know what you're doing, or trust a disinformation / secrecy service, in order to avoid "assimilation". Thus, a more complex info immune system to quantification will be forced to rapidly evolve.
I agree that along with the new era there will develop a new divide. At the same time,increasingly smart software and knowledge networks will push to make participation super easy and automatic. It will force us to reciprocally develop the skills to maintain privacy. You will really need to know what you're doing, or trust a disinformation / secrecy service, in order to avoid "assimilation". Thus, a more complex info immune system to quantification will be forced to rapidly evolve.
by
Paul Roberts
8 weeks ago
I think you are right about developments over time to make participation easy but the issues are cultural and social too, not just skilled base. I'm referring to a willingness to interact with others online as opposed to traditional social interaction.
I agree with you about privacy skills too. Add to that e-security skills.
I agree with you about privacy skills too. Add to that e-security skills.
11
by
wildcat
7 weeks ago
There is no doubt that participation in an hyperconnected world is problematic in more ways than one, not least of which are concepts that are transported from traditional modes and contexts into the web. for an exploratory discussion of trust and friendship in hyperconnectivity, see this twine: http://www.twine.com/twine/11h43rww7-2xq/friendship-in-hyperconnectivity
44
by
François Dongier
7 weeks ago
Here's my view of Nova's post (feel free to modify/version this mindmap)
http://www.mindmeister.com/maps/show_public/10432786
http://www.mindmeister.com/maps/show_public/10432786
5
by
rpfiii
7 weeks ago
Francois--that's absolutely facinating! And very well thought out. Where would you place such things as musical taste & mp3 collections, and for that matter, all the STUFF we accumulate through our life--movies, books, household goods, etc.?
And my wife and I were just talking about this one tonite at dinner--pantry, refrigerator, recipe book, calendar schedule, all communicating together so when I walk in the door at night, I have a potential list of acceptable recipes on my kitchen monitor showing all the possible meals we could cook that night, based on who's going to be home, what they like/don't like to eat, what's in the food stores at the moment, and how much time it will take to make and fit within everyone's schedule.
That to me is the web-wide-world, providing me directly with personal content that brings together all sorts of disparate data into a functional performance set, that is RELEVANT to my individual life activity.
And my wife and I were just talking about this one tonite at dinner--pantry, refrigerator, recipe book, calendar schedule, all communicating together so when I walk in the door at night, I have a potential list of acceptable recipes on my kitchen monitor showing all the possible meals we could cook that night, based on who's going to be home, what they like/don't like to eat, what's in the food stores at the moment, and how much time it will take to make and fit within everyone's schedule.
That to me is the web-wide-world, providing me directly with personal content that brings together all sorts of disparate data into a functional performance set, that is RELEVANT to my individual life activity.
3
by
Phil Duby
7 weeks ago
I think I provided [one possible] answer to that without reading your post :-)
Stuff: Things I own under My user-profile
tastes: under interests or preferences
For the acceptable recipes, mix in the family health information / diet restrictions (for medical or purely personal reasons). If the preliminary recipe options / schedules do not "match" well, you could get notified on the way home to pick up some ingredients, if that was not automatically added to the schedule before you left home.
Stuff: Things I own under My user-profile
tastes: under interests or preferences
For the acceptable recipes, mix in the family health information / diet restrictions (for medical or purely personal reasons). If the preliminary recipe options / schedules do not "match" well, you could get notified on the way home to pick up some ingredients, if that was not automatically added to the schedule before you left home.
3
by
Phil Duby
7 weeks ago
Darn, Google chrome will not show that. Just a blank page. Had to switch to FF to view. Now I can see it.
Interesting structure. Looks good. A few details / alternate ways of looking at pieces.
I do not see a particular reason to separate "Data on the web" and "INTERNET of tagged THINGS". At least for the portion "wearing a URL". It is all going to be web data. Some with geo coding, some without. Some with history / logs (sensor based data), some without.
The [garden] sensor data you show under "My user-profile" probably belongs under "Data on the web". Even though that is your own garden / sensors, given the other parts about "tagged things near me" under "My context", that sensor data is probably going to be 'on the web' (maybe private, but that is optional). The "My garden parameters" information *IS* part of the profile though, along with other 'preferences', like music, cuisine, sports, fashion, entertainment, more [under my interests I guess]. "where are my things?" is probably part of "tagged things near me", and My user-profile should have "What things do I own" with subsections for "What do I take with me?" for various activities. I see the profile as configurable but relatively static information. "where" is more dynamic and sensor driven. Then one of the "services" can match my context with the profile to remind you to pick up or leave behind the appropriate items depending on current plans. Add another [automatic] item to the context for "What I left home with" to prevent loosing things.
A good start. Could be expanded a lot, but there does not seem to be need for more to illustrate the concept, and the direction it could go.
Interesting structure. Looks good. A few details / alternate ways of looking at pieces.
I do not see a particular reason to separate "Data on the web" and "INTERNET of tagged THINGS". At least for the portion "wearing a URL". It is all going to be web data. Some with geo coding, some without. Some with history / logs (sensor based data), some without.
The [garden] sensor data you show under "My user-profile" probably belongs under "Data on the web". Even though that is your own garden / sensors, given the other parts about "tagged things near me" under "My context", that sensor data is probably going to be 'on the web' (maybe private, but that is optional). The "My garden parameters" information *IS* part of the profile though, along with other 'preferences', like music, cuisine, sports, fashion, entertainment, more [under my interests I guess]. "where are my things?" is probably part of "tagged things near me", and My user-profile should have "What things do I own" with subsections for "What do I take with me?" for various activities. I see the profile as configurable but relatively static information. "where" is more dynamic and sensor driven. Then one of the "services" can match my context with the profile to remind you to pick up or leave behind the appropriate items depending on current plans. Add another [automatic] item to the context for "What I left home with" to prevent loosing things.
A good start. Could be expanded a lot, but there does not seem to be need for more to illustrate the concept, and the direction it could go.
44
by
François Dongier
7 weeks ago
Thanks, Rick & Phil, for these nice ideas. Some seem very simple to integrate: music taste as detail of my interests, smart fridge as another device (with missing ingredient recommendations as another service), medical record as part of my profile.
What i find harder at this point is, as Phil pinpoints, to clarify the relation between the "internet of things" and "the web" as we know it now, made of documents and data.
About Chrome: Mindmeister works well for me with it. Do u have a problems accessing maps from http://www.mindmeister.com/maps/public ?
(note: sometimes it takes a good few seconds before Mindmeister responds).
Ah, also: I would rather do this with Imindi than MindMeister :)
What i find harder at this point is, as Phil pinpoints, to clarify the relation between the "internet of things" and "the web" as we know it now, made of documents and data.
About Chrome: Mindmeister works well for me with it. Do u have a problems accessing maps from http://www.mindmeister.com/maps/public ?
(note: sometimes it takes a good few seconds before Mindmeister responds).
Ah, also: I would rather do this with Imindi than MindMeister :)
3
by
Phil Duby
7 weeks ago
What I got in chrome as a blank page with a single horizontal scroll bar. No vertical scroll, and could not find anything in horizontal scroll area. Zoom out did not seem to do anything. When I tried it again just now, viewing and manual scrolling worked fine. Zoom and recenter still not repsonding. Help! The gremlins are playing in my computer!
3
by
Phil Duby
7 weeks ago
For "internet of things" and "the web", the only differences I see are [may be] how you locate and access the target. Is it a URL you lookup with some sort of data search, and access with http / tcp/ip, or is it [only] found / findable because it is in 'signal range' for bluetooth / wi-fi / other, and accessed directly from your own devices without any intermediate lookup (like DNS). A target that publishes its address by direct transmission, but is accessed as a URL, still falls into the first case for me. If there are devices that can be accessed directly, but are 'found' with a web based datasearch, I would say the actual device is in the second set, and the lookup service is just an independent 'phone book'. To distinguish between these cases does not require any information about what the device capabilities are. A simple sensor that reports the current temperature [and optionally geo-location] could be implemented either way, and the access path would determine which 'bucket' to put it in. Same for a points of interest historical information 'kiosk'. That could contain a relatively large [static or dynamic] data set, text, images, multimedia. The [today] obvious implementation would be a web page / site. But if it is only accesses locally / directly, I would put it in the second group instead.
Getting more ideas while writing this. Todays existing point of interest displays / kiosks are purely visual / manual [with maybe sensors to tell when someone is close]. Future ones could be much more mixed / interactive, using the [selected / public] profile information to choose what to display [first], and perhaps allow limited use for the display facilities as a remote screen for the 'personal mobile device' doing relating queries. Basically, allow the cell phone to become a remote control for the information display. For this as well, the bucket I would put it in depends on whether the kiosk has web access / is accessible from the web or not.
I guess I do the split based on 'connectivity', and that is fairly artificial. Things that are only accessible / noticeable when you are close enough (in 'sight', [visual, audio, rf]) I do not include in 'the web', any more than I would one of today's roadside billboards (although some of the new electronic billboards could be programmed / updated from the Internet).
Getting more ideas while writing this. Todays existing point of interest displays / kiosks are purely visual / manual [with maybe sensors to tell when someone is close]. Future ones could be much more mixed / interactive, using the [selected / public] profile information to choose what to display [first], and perhaps allow limited use for the display facilities as a remote screen for the 'personal mobile device' doing relating queries. Basically, allow the cell phone to become a remote control for the information display. For this as well, the bucket I would put it in depends on whether the kiosk has web access / is accessible from the web or not.
I guess I do the split based on 'connectivity', and that is fairly artificial. Things that are only accessible / noticeable when you are close enough (in 'sight', [visual, audio, rf]) I do not include in 'the web', any more than I would one of today's roadside billboards (although some of the new electronic billboards could be programmed / updated from the Internet).
| Shared or Added By | To | When | Comments |
| Nova Spivack | Nova Spivack | 2 months ago | 5 comments |
| Jonathan Decker | learning_with_web2.0 | 7 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Mauro Magnani | Social Networking - Trends and Technologies | 8 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| andyhalliday | Semantic Apps for Topical Collections | 8 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Jonathan Decker | Virtual Options for a Physical School … | 7 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Mauro Magnani | Web 3.0 - Semantic Web | 8 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| wildcat | Friendship in Hyperconnectivity - FH(_) | 2 months ago | 0 comments |
| Jonathan Decker | future education | 7 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Jonathan Decker | Educational Technology for the 21st Century | 7 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| wildcat | Polytopia | 2 months ago | 0 comments |
| Mauro Magnani | Mauro Magnani | 8 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Mauro Magnani | Social Networking Software and Services | 8 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Mauro Magnani | SEMANTIC SOCIAL NETWORK 2.0 - One World! | 8 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Jonathan Decker | Technology in Education | 7 weeks ago | 0 comments |
| Jonathan Decker | Cool | 7 weeks ago | 0 comments |
Tell me about Twine
Twine is convenient, new, powerful, smart, and totally devoted to whatever you're interested in. Read all about it.
Just to mention a text pointing the same kind of evolution as yours, from a World Wide Web to a World Life Web.
http://affordance.typepad.com/mon_weblog/2008/02/welcome-to-the.html
I am not a document. However, the trail I leave as I trample through the wilderness of the online jungle may become one. It is like footsteps in the sand. It's very easy to see where I've been and where I've come from, but much more difficult to determine where I may be going simply by reading this trail. When the web can extrapolate from the direction I've been taking, and get to the next destination before me, that is when convergence will take place.